I Don’t Do That Podcast (With Ocho)

I Don't Do That (with Ocho)
E12 - Podcast Recast and Forecast Season 1 - Part 2

Show Notes

The end of the year marks the end of Season 1 for the I Don’t Do That Podcast. Tune in as Ocho discusses upcoming highlights for Season 2, wishes for future podcast episodes, and reflections on Season 1. Season 2 starts next week!

Visit ko-fi.com/ocho for exclusive content as a supporter of this podcast!

[chimes, theme music]

Welcome to Podcast Recast Season One / Podcast Forecast Season Two.  In this episode, I wrap up Season One of I Don’t Do That.  If you haven’t listened to the podcast so far, I recommend you catch up and listen to the episodes that appeal to you, before listening to this one.  Or, you know what, you can start with this one.  I’m not gonna tell you what to do.  Who am I?  Your Mother?  Who am I?  A cop?  Who Am I?  Your third grade teacher who wouldn’t let you embellish the way you wrote your name by dotting the “I” with a little heart?  Listen to me: I’m none of those people; I’m Ocho, and I’m not gonna tell you what do to.  No.  What I’m gonna do in this episode, is I’m going to share some of the upcoming topics for season 2 which will start next week, I will talk about some plans and wishes for the future of the podcast, and I will offer my reflections on the first eleven episodes.

[theme music plays] “na na na na na yeah nah I don’t do that, no I don’t do that.  You know it’s alright; you can ask, but I don’t do that, no I don’t do that.  I don’t do that.  I don’t do that.

Ocho.  First of all, the exciting stuff!  On the docket for season 2, we have some intriguing topics: We have I Don’t Do Punk Rock, a story of Aaron, a non-punk rocker who, in his hometown, started a music scene that turned punk on him; We have I Don’t Drive A Car: Finally, a grandmother who took your suggestion and got off the road; We have I Don’t Weigh Myself, a discussion on body positivity, There’s I Don’t Use A Cell Phone, I Don’t Talk To My Dad, and more.  It’s gonna be a great season.  

We also have some fantastic content for members, which will include interviews of me, Ocho, by podcast listener/subscribers.  A variety of folks will be asking me, Ocho, about a variety of topics, including: I Don’t Stream My Music.  (That’s me, people, I don’t), I Don’t Work For Someone Else (Also Applies To Me), and I Don’t Speed In My Car (my insurance is cheap).  Those interviews are coming up in season 2.  It’s a nifty switcheroo where the listeners ask me the questions for a change.  And you will be able to access that content by donating as little as 4 dollars per month at idontdothatpodcast.com/give. That’s idontdothatpodcast.com/give.  You can contribute via paypal or credit card, and you can cancel any time.  Some people already have!  You will also have access to exclusive video content including music and comedy; I also grant contributors the audacity to request videos: For example, this year, I played a christmas song for our friend Barb, and I made a ukulele tutorial for our friend Kate, because they asked me.  And because they made a contribution at idontdothatpodcast.com/give.  You can too!  Members also get the option to interview me.  How about that?  The upcoming interviews will be from our friends Aron from Sioux Falls, our friend Ogar from Southern Minnesota, and our friend Taman from Minneapolis.  You can too!  Do you want to interview me?  Does that sound exciting?  Contact me at ochotunes.com/contact and let me know.  I have the following topics on the table for me, Ocho:  I, Ocho, personally do not: have kids, watch sports, use alcohol or any recreational drugs, I don’t scroll social media or count calories, I don’t hold babies, ride on motorcycles, play video games…I don’t do family entertainment

(G Rated movies, kids music, nah!), I don’t watch/listen to/read news media, I don’t talk about politics, eat fast food, dance with people (solo only), I don’t gamble, reveal people’s secrets, “brand” myself, Social climb, I Don’t Have Any Pets.  Do you want to hear about that stuff?  Do you want to talk to me about it?  We can do it, and record it, and air the episode.  Visit idontdothatpodcast.com/give to become a member today.  Please and Thank You!

Eleven episodes in the books over about three months,

so I’ll call this the end of season 1.  I wasn’t planning on it, but it’s the Holidays so I figure I’d take a week off and call it a season.  It’s a new year, good time to start a new season.  It’s been about three months which is about the length of one of the four seasons.  So that’s a season.  We have seasons now.  Deal with it.

It’s been a really enriching experience for me, having the opportunity to interview everyone.  I hope it has been for you too.  I’ve laughed, learned things, been inspired, surprised…it’s been emotional, insightful, educational…I now know that Denver is, in fact, officially, exactly one mile high.  

I can appreciate the perspective of everyone I’ve talked to.  For example, I have a much better idea of the nuances of non-monogamy.  I suppose before this, I thought, “oh, yeah.  You’d just mess around with whomever, and make sure they know you’re playing the field, and call it good.” Or you have a primary partner with an open relationship…maybe those are good quick and dirty explanations, but now I see a lot more subtlety, when you consider what your boundaries might be, and all of your other partners’ boundaries, and also what your needs are, along with your other partners’ needs, it could start to look like a lot of different things.  

In that episode, episide 8, Seth talk about boundaries more than I expected.  Like, “Let’s not text every day,”  That’s very appropriate for this show.  I Don’t Do That: I Don’t Text My Partner Every Day.  

I’d love to talk with other guests who have boundaries surrounding texting.  These days I’m looking for guests, so If you want to talk to me, go to ochotunes.com/guest to apply to be a guest on the show.  And on that page, ochotunes.com/guest, I actually have a list of suggestions for things we might talk about.  It’s around 200 different possibilites.  So if you want to talk to me, and you’re struggling to come up with a topic, you can check out that list.  It’s pretty fun to look at even if you don’t want to come on the show.  Again, that’s at ochotunes.com/guest.  

Also, if you have a topic you’d like to hear about, or if you have a question about the show, hit me up at ochotunes.com/contact.  As I mentioned, I am looking for guests to interview in 2023.  Interviews can be in person, on the phone, or on video chat.  If you’re a podcaster, if you’re someone with a name for yourself, maybe you’re building your social network, getting on my podcast will be a great way to help both of our networks.  Maybe I can get on yours, too?  

If you aren’t building a social network, that’s great too.  I’m really looking to talk to all kinds of people.  Not just popular people, or people who are trying to be popular.  In fact, if you’re not trying to be popular, that would be a great thing to talk about.  But whoever you are: Maybe you have money.  Maybe you don’t have money.  Maybe you’ve been around the world.  Maybe you’ve never left your hometown.  Maybe you’re really talented with a lot of achievements.  Maybe you’re not.  I’m trying to represent a variety of people.  That’s one of the ongoing goals for this show.  Part of that effort has been to represent racial and gender diversity as well.  I’m doing the best I can at that right now.  I finally got my first guest from outside the United States.  That conversation will air on Season 2.  I would be thrilled to have more international guests in 2023, as well as non-white, non-binary, non-comforming in whatever sense.  I’ve had 2 non-binary guests on the show so far, and at least one coming up in season 2, but it’s not been a topic yet.  I would like to talk to someone about that.  I Don’t Identify With My Assigned Gender.

Also on my wish list: I’d like to have a guest who lives in the U.S. and doesn’t speak English.  That’s a perspective I’d like to hear from.  Obviously I’d need to find myself an interpreter.  But I’m up for the challenge, so if that describes you or someone you know, and you want to talk about that experience, I’d love to have you on.  I have diversity goals.  

Some other challenges I’d like to meet:  I would love to talk to someone about being deaf, about not hearing, either via text or interpreter.  I would be honored to air a story about that.  Anything regarding ability status, I think, needs to be heard.  As a reminder, you can apply to be a guest at ochotunes.com/contact or at ochotunes.com/guest. 

So many of us don’t really know what it’s like, how it feels, to NOT do things because the things we don’t do are often invisible, intangible.  We’re usually not aware of them immediately.  Sometimes we are.  Like “hey that guy isn’t wearing any pants.” ok.  Sure.  But for other things, like “I Don’t Pray,” which was Shiloh in Episode 6, you wouldn’t really know unless they told you.  And even when you’re aware of something like that, like if you have a relationship with a non-praying person, for example, you might forget.  It’s ok to forget, you know, but I think life is better when we are aware of other people’s experiences.  I’m happy to report that I’ve been getting that from the show.  I am becoming more aware of other people’s experiences.  I hope you are too.  This has been entertainment for me, and self-improvement as well.  

And there’s so much more to cover, so many possibilities.  I’m excited to see where it goes.  I might sound like a broken record, but I’d love it if you want to get involved.  Maybe someone you know has a good story.  Maybe you’re out in the world, and somebody you know literally says, “Nah, I don’t do that.”  Tell them about the show!  Maybe they want to share their story.  Again, anyone interested can reach out on ochotunes.com/contact or at ochotunes.com/guest.  I should add, too, that I can keep the guests anonymous if they desire.  We can use a different name; I can even disguise your voice electronically, if you want.

Other things I want for 2023: I want to talk more about smaller things.  I’d like to do more short episodes, so I want to get some trivial topics on the table:  I’m sure a lot of you don’t honk your car horn.  I was riding in a car last week…sitting behind someone who stayed at a green light for a few seconds.  It wasn’t long, but it was too long.  We were in the car sitting behind this other car for like 10 seconds, maybe.  My friend, the driver, just waited.  That led to a short conversation about when we honk and don’t honk the horn.  It was a great little talk; I wish I had recorded it.  Personally, I’m quicker to honk than a lot of people I ride with.  But STILL, I have boundaries and guidelines about honking.  Do you want to know what they are?  Come on the show, and take the other side.  Tell me that you don’t honk your horn.  I’d love to talk to you about that.  For like 10 minutes.  I think it’d make a great short episode. Find me at ochotunes.com/contact or at ochotunes.com/guest. 

One more thing, and then I’ll stop trying to recruit you:  I’ve been out there in real life talking to people about coming on the podcast, and they’ll say something like “yeah, well I guess I don’t do a lot of things, but it’s not that interesting.  Like, I don’t usually answer my phone, but I mean who cares?  A lot of people don’t do that.”  But the thing is, to ME, that IS interesting.  So I ask that you believe me, and if you are willing to talk about it, I would appreciate it.  And I will make it interesting.  I promise.  It’s my job.  I can do it, because I’m curious, and I love talking to people.  Having conversations about things they don’t do.  I’ll consider it a challenge.  Maybe whatever boring thing you come up with, maybe it’s interesting for 5 or 10 minutes.  That’s great.  The format would just have 2 or 3 short discussions in one episode.  That sounds entertaining right?  

Actually, I DARE you to make it uninteresting.  Go to ochotunes.com/contact.  Tell me that you want to come on the show and talk about how you don’t ever retie your shoes.  You just smoosh and wriggle your feet in there, every single time.  Just smoosh and wriggle your feet.  Do anything to avoid actually untying and retying your shoes.  That’s gold!  Why are you keeping that to yourself?  What kind of selfish miscreant sleeps on a topic like that?  Come on my podcast!  Apply at ochotunes.com/contact or at ochotunes.com/guest.  Don’t make me come and find you, ok?

In summary: Whatever you’re like, whatever the subject matter, Deep or shallow, complex or mundane, long or short, popular or outcast, familiar or obscure, I’d love to hear from you.  Contact me at ochotunes.com/contact or at ochotunes.com/guest.  

Anyway, back to Seth in EP08.  I was talking about that, right?  On reflection, I’m really impressed by Seth’s commitment to non-monogamy.  I might say that he’s married to the endeavor.  But seriously, I must confess that I guess I probably assumed that non-monogamy was going to consider the possibility of monogamy.  Like it could be compromised if the situation were a certain way.  In hindsight, I might have asked “can you imagine any situation in which you’d end up in a domestic partnership with one person?”  I’d be thinking maybe just as a coincidence.  Like suppose you had a partner, and you both agreed “This is an open relationship,” but then you ended up living together, sharing a life, doing the escalator-style relationship that’s based on dating, graduating to living together, buying a house, getting married, whatever…But all the while, the relationship had the benefit of being able to explore loving and sexual relationships with other people.  But say they never took advantage of that benefit.  They just stayed open to the possibility.

My guess is that Seth would say “No.  I would not settle down like that.  I know that’s not for me, and I’m not gonna do it.”  You know what?  That actually really blows my mind.  I like to think I spend a lot of time finding exceptions, thinking outside of the box.  But that one got me.  I guess I gotta ask him.  I don’t want to put words in his mouth, so maybe I just need more.  I believe I have another person who’s gonna talk to me about non-monogamy, too.  So we might hear a complimentary story in Season 2.  

Maybe I’ll do an episode with some follow-ups.  There are a number of things that didn’t occur to me until later.  Hey, if you have a question for any of my Season 1 guests, send me a message at ochotunes.com/contact and I’ll see if I can follow up.

I’ve always wanted to do a “previously on,” but I’ve never had the opportunity.

Tangent, but related: Did you see the Rick and Morty Episode this season where they had superheroes that were actually storytelling devices?  This is reminding me of the Previous Leon character.  That cracked me up.  As a writer, I couldn’t have been more happy with that episode.  What a joy.  

I’d also like to follow up with Tyler and Ethan from Episode 9: Jehovah’s Witnesses Don’t.  There are a long list of things that JWs don’t do, that we didn’t get to talk about.  Or maybe there’s some other ex JWs that want to talk to me about it?  I’m just gonna share the rest of the list with you now, just as food for thought.  Some of these continue to surprise me, and/or make me wonder.  Things we didn’t cover:  Jehovah’s Witnesses are not allowed to:


Politically organize

Run for office

Participate in labor strike

Practice yoga

Serve jury duty

Study social sciences

Non-hetero relations

Celebrate Mother’s/Father’s Day

Serve in leadership roles

Own religious images

Read horoscope

Have women as leaders

I’m sure it would also be interesting to talk to someone from the organization who was more inclined to explain or defend their position on these things.  I don’t know if I would go there.  I really try to stay out of these things and let people tell their stories.  But I guess if someone’s deal is being preachy or being on a soapbox, or trying to restrict other people’s right to live their lives, or if they’re trying to recruit people into their way of believing, I don’t really consider that to be good entertainment.  Those folks can get their own podcast.  Or better yet, shut your mouth and look around.  Use your ears.  Try to listen to new ideas.  Just try.  Try something new.  Try some new food or some new music.  Some new ideas.  Read some books.  Go hug some new people.  

One thing about the exJW episode that really didn’t hit me until I was editing and transcribing it:  These guys have had the fear of the end of the world put into them since birth.  That’s gotta affect your psychology right?  Imagine that.  Hard to fathom.  

I mentioned Shiloh earlier too.  The thing that sticks with me from that episode is the contemplative process that they have developed to declutter their mind and put faith in themselves.  Looking back, I wish I could have gone deeper into that at the time.  The process of creating touchstones I found to be very insightful.  Remembering things that you have done well, times you have succeeded.  Creating tangible reminders of those things, because you might need them later.  There were a number of really useful things in that conversation that I feel like I didn’t quite grasp until later.  Like, make art that expresses what you want to remember, how you want to think and be.  Good art.  Genuine art.  Create it.  Revisit it.  

So, these episodes, I end up editing and transcribing them, so as a result, I listen to them at least three times each.  Minimum.  I listen when I have the conversation, I listen again when I edit the conversation, I’ll cut stuff out, add music, mix the sound, and stuff, and then I let the software transcribe it, but it’s riddled with errors, so I listen to it again when I’m fixing the errors.  By that time, I usually notice something I missed, or think of something I should have asked or whatever.  You might say that sounds like it gets mundane, or like it’s a lot of work.  And you wouldn’t be wrong, but the good news is that the episodes stand up to repeated listening, and I get to learn that firsthand when I edit and transcribe them.  And I pick up on things that I miss.  And I think more deeply about it.  

The fun thing about talking to David was, when we started, I had absolutely no idea of why they don’t clap their hands.  Sometimes I’ll go in with some background.  But it seemed like such a quirky thing to have no explanation.  I’m just gonna coin a term right now: habisn’t.  It’s like a habit that you don’t do.  habisn’t.  get it?  you can use that one. h-a-b-i-s-n-‘-t.  It’s in the dictionary now. So David has a habisn’t of not clapping their hands.  It’s an unexpected habisn’t.  I’d never heard of it.  So ohe thing I didn’t do, and I hope I never do on this show, is ask “why.”  I was a therapist for a few years, early in my career, and part of my training was to avoid asking why.  Nobody actually knows why.  You might get someone talking with “why,” but, since you are essentially asking them to explain their behavior, they generally just spit out a bunch of constructs that they already have in their head.  Ideally, they would be covering new ground, gaining insights, not just repeating things that they already think.  

“Why” can also put people on the defensive.  

So instead I ask how it started, how people react, if they make exceptions, what they do instead, etc.  And generally, as with David, people end up telling you their “why” story anyway.  In that case, it was pretty direct.  If, as a kid, someone used to make you do something to the point of discomfort, it seems like a no-brainer.  That’s exactly what happened with David.  They don’t clap their hands “because” they had to do it too much in church as a kid.

These conversations have had far more to do with religion and spirituality than I ever expected.  I’ve mentioned four of them so far: prayer, monogamy, clapping, and Jehovah’s Witness.  All of those had to do at least partially with religion and/or spirituality.  So did my conversation with Melissa about not drinking alcohol.  Sometimes those conversations are spiritual and sometimes not.  I have been thinking a lot about going on her podcast, which we’re planning, but we don’t have it in the calendar yet.  It’s called The Awakening Hour, and she focuses on psychology, spirituality and sobriety.  So there’s a lot we could talk about.  

Oh, here’s an update: Ogar is actually playing drums again!  I saw a photo on social media of him playing drums, so I reached out to him on the phone.  I’ll air our conversation later, but I’ll let you know right now: he’s happy about it.  He’s wiser about it, and he’s playing with people who are good friends.  I didn’t really expect that to happen, but it reminded me of my very first episode with Carson who spontaneously said “all of this is making me want to try soup.”  And Seth also said something about having to get in the headspace of thinking of what it’s like to be monogamous, because he wasn’t used to thinking about it.  So it’s been unexpected to see people examining the other side while we’re talking.  Maybe I shouldn’t be surprised at the open-mindedness.  I am trying to promote open-mindedness on the show.  

One thing I was genuinely surprised about was Marsha’s experience with social media.  I guess I expected that episode 3 would be another light topic, in the vein of the first two (not eating soup, and not clapping your hands).  But wow.  I was taken aback by the experience she’d had with social media being used to threaten school shootings, and being used for sexual harassment  

against her.  I guess it’s because I’m on social media myself, and while I find it annoying in a lot of ways, and I have boundaries associated with it, I haven’t seen anything that bad.  I never expected it.  Really opened my eyes.  I have a conversation coming up in season 2 where we talk to Fuzzy who, in contrast to Marsha, WAS on social media a LOT as a content creator, and then quit due to things getting bad.  Marsha had always stayed off, but Fuzzy did a total 180 and just quit.  So what I’m getting from both of those conversations is that although social media on the surface tries to look like a happy place, and sometimes is, for sure.  But it also has a real dark side that causes people to get rid of it, or keep it out of their lives.  I guess it’s kind of like school for Melody, in that we think it’s for everyone.  Both school and social media are made for everyone, and the intention is that everyone uses them.  But probably neither of them are really for everyone.  It’s easy to say that the person on the outside, the person who doesn’t do those things, is weird or that there’s something wrong with them.  But I think that institutions are made for the benefit of people.  School is, for sure.  It’s seen as part of your development and a measure of success, because its purpose is to help you develop and succeed.  And sometimes the institution fails students, and then the institution says that the students fail.  Perhaps the students do fail, but doesn’t the institution also fail?  If it’s the institution’s purpose and intention to help the student succeed?  Can we really say that the student was the only cause of that outcome?  

This took a rhetorical turn, I guess.  Personally, I wouldn’t say that anyone or anything necessarily failed.  But I would say that in some cases, it seems that the educational system is not for everyone.  And if it’s meant to be universal, then it isn’t perfect.  It isn’t 100% universal.

And maybe the same is true for social media.  If social media is hostile, does it not have some failings as a place for friends?  That seems like a fair criticism.  Maybe it’s not harsh enough.  My view tends to be pretty well tempered.  I hope you appreciate it.  There’s enough high octane opinion out there.  

Speaking of things that are supposed to work for everyone, maybe we could discuss religion for a minute.  I studied a lot of cultural anthropology when I was in college.  One idea that I learned about, which dominated that field, is that every culture ever on the earth, in general, that we know about, has or has had, what cultural anthropologists would call a religion.  Now there’s a lot of diversity in there.  There’s a lot of things that they would call religion that you might not.  But I think it still says something about the universality of religion.  

One thing it doesn’t say, though, is that every single individual person in all of those cultures practices that religion.  It doesn’t say that the practices work for everyone, it doesn’t say that every individual person is enriched by the mythology.  It’s part of the culture, and it’s there for everyone in town, but it’s not FOR everyone in town.  And again, we’ll find people quick to blame the ones who are different.  They say “you are wrong, you are flawed,” because you don’t fit in with this thing that’s supposed to be universal.  And others might resist this idea and say “no, your institutions are flawed because they don’t work for us.”  I just wanna say, everyone’s flawed, ok?  Nobody’s perfect. No individual, no institution, no nation, no religion.  And more importantly, MUCH more importantly: HOW WONDERFUL.  How beautiful and intricate and amazing that there’s always an exception.  That there’s someone who doesn’t eat soup, or play sports or clap our hands.  And if you’re a weirdo and you know it, then you know yourself.  I can tell you, it’s a surefire way to encounter yourself.  Try to fit in and find out you don’t.  You will know that part of yourself very well.  

Not fitting in is a big theme.  It’s not all of what this show is about.  It’s a weird concept, it’s literally negative, kind of inverted, “I Don’t Do That,” and I’m still finding the edges.  Thanks for coming along with me, and helping me.

I’m very thankful for these glimpses into other people’s lives, I was talking about public school.  And I’m very grateful for Melody’s insight.  She seems like a happy person.  She’s found her way.  She’s able to follow her intellectual pursuits without a degree.  I noticed that she and I read a lot of the same nonfiction.  And she’s found her people.  But to me there’s still an element of sadness to the backstory, that the public school system couldn’t handle a gifted student with a learning disability.  And it seems like social class had something to do with it, and the social nerdiness that has a place now, but it didn’t in the 80s and 90s when she was coming up.  That’s when I was in school too, and I can tell you, it was not ok to be a nerd back then.  “Nerd” was an insult.  We’ve come a long way in recognizing the value of nerdiness.  

So there’s the social class, the social uniqueness, and a kid who didn’t graduate, and still can score in the 90th percentile on her SATs.  She’s consistently underchallenged by everything in school, and she finds math confusing.  And the school doesn’t know what to do with her.  And the thing is, she’s not misbehaving.  She’s keeping her nose clean.  She’s not dangerous, not fighting, stealing, etc.  My heart goes out to the kid.  Kids are vulnerable people.  So are parents.  Parenting is hard.  How about the institutions?  Are they vulnerable?  They seem pretty tough to me.  An institution will kick your ass.  I don’t know if that happened with Melody or not, but I do know that she turned out to be great.  She’s a person that I personally want to have in the world.  She’s good for us.  

José too! I was really intrigued by his story about moving around all over the world.  It seems really stimulating and challenging.  I’m lucky enough to have met a few people throughout my life who are really motivated to go out and experience the world.  I have a discussion coming up in season 2 with Paul who is a self-avowed hedonist, so he’s all about experience.  Paul doesn’t restrain his desires.  That was a fun conversation, and I look forward to airing it for you.  

Finally, I mentioned that I’m talking with Fuzzy in season 2 about quitting social media…You will be able to hear me LIVE on Fuzzy’s podcast, Fuzzjock Radio, on Monday January 9th 2023 at 10:30pm CST.  Or any time on fuzzjockradio.com.  I guess I’m going to talk about NOT following sports, because, I Don’t Do That.  So I had a very relatable time talking about not playing sports with Molly on episode 10.  You should know that whether I can relate to you or not, I’m going to do my best to get into whatever you aren’t into.  I’ll be back next week with a new episode.  Stay tuned for the update with Ogar who now doesn’t not play drums anymore, it’s a pretty heartwarming story.  Thanks to all of my contributors, for your memberships and donations at idontdothatpodcast.com/give.  You help support the show!  Thanks to our sponsor Prime Time Web.  Thanks to you for all that you do and all that you don’t do.  I’ll talk to you again, if I’m lucky.


“I Don’t Do That…”

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